Say it isn't so....MEAT got Beat...?

[Killer Klownz]

if memory serves me well (which it always does), i have beaten you on ...cough....

Killing more bots than the other players is not beating anyone, it's merely winning the map . Big difference . . . to beat a player you've got to be killing the player . . . a lot . . .

[MEAT]

while your seeing the dr. for your cough MEAT...maybe you should ask him about selective memory loss.... or maybe your just gettin old?
if memory serves me well (which it always does), i have beaten you on ...cough....THREE...cough occasions. i think i even have a screenshot floating around too.. but, beating you isnt my number one goal and never has been.. telefragging you is. You know your gunna get the biggest heckling of your life right here on this forum...when/if it ever happens. Ive been so damn close...

Well I am getting old and I will admit I've been beaten a number of times.
Just like all newbies I took my licks in the beginning and even today I've lost to
many of players who have killed more bots then me.
Repeat: more bots then me.

But like a great player once said:

Killing more bots than the other players is not beating anyone, it's merely winning the map . Big difference . . . to beat a player you've got to be killing the player . . . a lot . . .

And as for you telefragging me...well I doubt that will ever happen.
But if you ask real nicely I'll sit still and I'll give you a free one...

[ELvis]

KK said "Killing more bots than the other players is not beating anyone, it's merely winning the map . Big difference . . . to beat a player you've got to be killing the player . . . a lot . ."

INDEED!!

[*POTS*]

Hi Scify....thanks for not mentioning that you beat me once.
It will be our little secret...

Ah yes I've found the screenshot but I won't post it since MEAT has helped me (plus he may start telefragging me 24/7 in revenge... )

[bumMmonkeY]

ah ha ha ha....how easily we forget. lol

and no offence at all intended... but you arnt exactly known for ONLY shootin at realtime players MEAT. ive always said...get rid of them stupid bots so that they are only there for 3 or less players...and dont get in the way of REAL deemer battles...but noooooo, we gotta keep em... we gotta have em butting in to REAL fights.
Considering how much time lame ass programmers spend trying to write mods for just about everything ut99...you would think at least ONE person would have tried to write or adapt a half realistic and non highly annoying engine for bots! granted bots are kinda lame and serve ALOT of ppl in winning MRS games...im sorry old boy, but that just aint me. i have a policy...i only shoot at them if they shoot at me....if they arnt there...what excuse can ANYONE make?
Just seems like the only way to end the arguement once and for all....get rid of em.

which brings me back to my next point.....what the hell is wrong with your server not sending LAmapVOTE, Tnali and COWMESH skins????


AH HA HA i copied and pasted it this time....
which brings me back to my second point... what is with the submit button taking me back to the login screen after writing a huge long post???

[bumMmonkeY]

....i see alot of excuses for why other ppl are bad at the game and the way they win... but you know what? i never see reasons as to what makes a good player. I guess thats the difference huh? a "good" player is "good" because he throws accusations around about other ppls wins and other "good" players just agreee.. oh yeah...and of course...LOW PING helps.....

for example...it wast that long ago that KA---LOWNZ was my lil beyatch..
wont be long till he is again. xxx sweety
but regardless of that fact, he will still try and tell me im a bot shooter? lmao
Seems round here ya need to own a deemer server of your own to get a lil respect.
cuz obviously...never remembering to date being beaten by a mere klown isnt enough.

but then again, what do i know, im just a player with a low ping and no server of my own,

bitchy, i know, but seriously......

[Killer Klownz]

cuz obviously...never remembering to date being beaten by a mere klown isnt enough.

Klownz was not accusing you of being a mere bot killer. Klownz stated what Klownz stated. To beat a player you've got to be killing the player . . . a lot . . . simple and a fact. It was a general statement meant for all players. Klownz does not care about winning or losing . . . only the kill. Running a server has NOTHING to do with respect. Klownz asks for none, because this is just a game. You were never on the Klownz list which means you were never kicking the Klownz butt. Klownz finished that list a while ago . . . before Klownz started {RVH}. However if you do feel aggrieved, Klownz can arrange a match with bots or no bots if you'd like . . . . .

bumMmonkeY vs Killer_klownz

or

bumMmonkeY vs MEAT

or better yet

bumMmonkeY vs MEAT vs Killer_Klownz

If none of the above is acceptable then everyone knows where the Klownz can be found . . . Klownz runs from no one . . . .

[MEAT]

I kind of like it when the Klownz talks in the 3rd person.
Let me try it..."The MEAT is going kick your BUTT".
The MEAT likes this...lol
Anyway, bots...is that the topic of choice?
Talk about beating a dead horse...lol And why is it we always call it a dead horse?
If it's being talked about by new and old players it obviously isn't dead.
And there are so many people that argue about bots or no bots...gentle or aggressive bots.
I remember having this conversation (argument) with VETTE one.
His thoughts (and please don't quote me on this) is that there should be bots. The more bots the better.
That the games would be boring without them and that the makers/designers of UT added bots for that reason.
And I wish I could find the thread but I think Hermskii removed because it got out of hand.
But this whole thing started when VETTE (supposedly one of the better old skool players) entered one of my games
and I ended up handing him his azz on a plater. He was a fish out of water because he wasn't hitting anything
with all his spraying. So he starts to complain that there wasn't any bots. Wasn't any bots for what?
But my whole argument was that I think the makers/designers of UT made this game so that
"real" people could play against real people.
Bots to me are just fillers...they are there so people offline have someone/something to play against.
Sure I can see bots online, just because if one person enters a game he has something to play against and won't leave.
But I don't think we should have a map full of bots and crown the victor for killing the most bots.
And that's the problem I see with some servers...to many bots especially in smaller maps.
And the argument, "well that's the way it was in the beginning", that doesn't make it right.
Times, maps and mods have changed...now we can do something about it...now we can
correct what is obviously wrong or what doesn't make sense.
It's like any other game or sport it evolves and it gets better.
Anyway...
A botless server...that would be great and it's the only fair way to play and win.

[*POTS*]

Bots on CG are so cute, they let you telefrag them with ease. <3

Bots on RVH are mean, they've got like 200% alertness, they can hear you farting from a mile away and start spraying plenty of warheads.

Bots on MRS are a balanced compromise.

I think bots reflect their owners' personality, so enjoy them.

[bumMmonkeY]

first of all KLOWNZ...

What list are you talking about? if this was a vengeance list of some discription then KLOWNZ should have had my monkey azz at the top...again...how easily we forget.
I remember you from when youd pop into MRS on very rare occasions with NO skill and i remember you up to when you became a regular with some skill.. get the pen and paper out baby...i think your gunna be writting a brand spankin new list with my name on it.
Thats right...KLOWNZ is gunna eat KLOWNZ' own azz with a spoon!

And...MEAT...My dear MEAT..

So can i read between the lines that my idea of having bots for 3 or less players only should come into effect? Lets face it, if anyone is gunna have a cry because bots arnt there to kill, do ya really want em playing...besides, bots are just gunna get in the way of all that glorius KLOWN blood flying everywhere! I mean VETTE is a classic example of this.

[MEAT]

And...MEAT...My dear MEAT..
So can i read between the lines that my idea of having bots for 3 or less players only should come into effect? Lets face it, if anyone is gunna have a cry because bots arnt there to kill, do ya really want em playing...besides, bots are just gunna get in the way of all that glorius KLOWN blood flying everywhere! I mean VETTE is a classic example of this.

Actually I've been using the mod BodenX since day one on my server.
With the mod I can set how many bots and bot skill levels for 50 maps.
And currently I think I have default set at 4 bots. So out of the 50 maps
with Boden I have anywhere from 2 to 12 bots...depending on the size of map.
And as for skill level it's set at Skilled. Had Godlike for awhile but the
bots kept winning...lol

So as for those that cry about bots...well you're right...those players with
better skills prefer less bots. But you have to appease the masses...

[bumMmonkeY]

politics...damn huh?

KLOWNZ, its only a matter of time till i take up your offer...

[MEAT]

politics...damn huh?

Yeah, well it's that or lose them to a spray and pray server.
Then again most people can't handle my server.
No one wants to improve their skills...just spray for 2 mins
and hope for a win...sad
Anyway, I suggest you practice the art of kill...because KK is not
your ordinary painted face hillbilly.
His got game...although it's mostly spray...hmm

[Hermskii]

This is fun! For the record again at CG the winner is whoever kills something or somebody else 30 times first. The end. All frags count at CG even the poor little bots. There is skill in killing the most things the fastest EVEN if they are bots.

Know that CG's bot amount was based solely on 2 things:

1. There was a time when CG rarely ever had less than 5 players on it at any given moment. I put in just under that many bots to make sure that there was maintained activity if there were ever fewer players than that.

2. As maps got bigger they got more boring for the small map regulars especially if there was nobody on at the time to play against. Even with several bots you could be searching for minutes before ever coming across one. That would take longer than most games used to last on CG with the old default maps. It was just way too slow and the regulars hated it so I put some bots back on the server. BTW, CG has 3 players right now and MRS and RVH both have a big zero.. Hehehe. MHM has 2 players right now and MRS and RVH each have a big zero. Hehehe. I'm thinking that if MEAT, Klownz and BumMonkey can agree to play at the same location all of the time then MRS or RVH may show some activity here tonight or soon.

Either way you want to look at it doesn't matter. CG is my server and more in line with the original settings of the original Redeemer Mod servers and the rules by which they played. I'm not saying CG is better or the old rules are better. I'm saying I'm glad I know exactly where I stand when it comes to what is fair and what isn't ON MY SERVER. Who-ever kills 30 times first on CG wins. The end. There is no rebuttle.

Now on to these newer, more popular, more modified Redeemer Mod servers: I have to admit that I agree that MEAT and KLOWNZ both stress that bots suck and that the true-grit-skill of this mod CAN'T be measured so long as any bot is in the measure on these servers. Thus, I declare that MRS and RVH both should immediately remove all bots from play from now on. I also declare that you should all make a date and fight ot out on any server of your choice and post pictures and results and snickers and everything here so we can all know "The Truth". Also know that I declare these servers are yours and you can do whatever you want with them . One truth I know is that if you do remove all of the bots from your servers nobody will play on them anymore. DON"T SAY I DID NOT WARN YOU!

I just know that if I played pool and every time I went to a certain pool-hall I was beaten badly, I'd start going to a differernt pool hall where I might win once in a while. Another analogy could be the old saying you can only beat a dog so many times before he'll stop coming to you when you call him. All this talk about who is the best, winning by way of the purest competitive method and all of this doesn't matter much when you only have yourselves to play with unless that is OK with each of you. Have a great day!

[MEAT]

As maps got bigger they got more boring for the small map regulars especially if there was nobody on at the time to play against. There is no rebuttle.

The sad part is no one (small map regulars) had the skill set to get better on the bigger maps.
They were all one dimensional players (sprayers) that hated change or couldn't evolve.
Boring...no. Because it requires more thought and skill to play and not spray.
And I should know because I was there. So when a med to large size map came up they would leave.
Sad but true.
But I tell you what...if the Redeemer mod, a mod you would think is designed for larger maps, if this mod
would of first been played and enjoyed on larger maps and then we turned to smaller maps...do you think we would be
having this discussion?
Or do you think we would be bad mouthing spraying in smaller maps?
And don't give me the answer, "well it didn't happen that way".
That again is one dimensional.